Recognizing the Need for Answers: Inattentive ADHD - Martin Hauck
Martin Hauck- Bio
Martin's coach recently helped him identify his purpose and although it's not finished, the current draft looks and sounds like this:
Build cool things, with cool people and help people believe in themselves or find what they're looking for.
For the first decade of his career, he helped contractors and manufacturers find the parts they needed to keep their businesses running smoothly.
For the last decade of his career, he's helped tech companies like Rangle, Stackadapt, Coinsquare and Caseware find the people they need to grow and scale.
And now, (as of March 2023) he's re-joined the world of entrepreneurship by continuing to grow The People People Group (a 5,000 HR/Recruitment Slack community) and launching Purple Umbrella (a fractional People Ops consultancy) with his business partner Monica Sarkar.
In between all that, he's a geeky dad and ever-improving husband who runs on espresso and is always exploring something new who can talk your ear off about crypto, aliens, VR/AR and Dungeons & Dragons.
Contact Links:
Websites: The People People Group, Purple Umbrella Co.
Instagram: The People People Group
LinkedIn: Martin Hauck
Summary:
In this podcast episode, Martin takes us on a personal journey through the complexities of living with inattentive ADHD, from the initial struggles of managing day-to-day responsibilities and meeting deadlines to the emotional journey of seeking diagnosis and embracing acceptance. He candidly discusses the challenges he faced before understanding the root of his difficulties, shedding light on the often misunderstood aspects of navigating life with an invisible condition. Martin talks about the fears surrounding the potential stigma of ADHD, the dilemmas of disclosing his condition in professional settings, and the critical importance of self-advocacy.
Beyond sharing his own story, Martin extends an invitation to listeners, encouraging them to embrace vulnerability, share their experiences, and foster a supportive community. He underscores the balance between using ADHD as an explanation, not an excuse, and the empowering act of owning one's story in the face of societal misconceptions. Through the conversation, the podcast highlights the significance of community, vulnerability, and self-advocacy in overcoming the challenges posed by invisible illnesses.
Martin's journey is not only a testament to personal resilience but also a call to action for greater understanding and support for those navigating similar paths.
Takeaways and Why you Should Listen:
The Power of Community and Sharing: Martin emphasizes how a friend's openness about his ADHD journey on social media inspired him to seek a diagnosis and treatment, illustrating the significant impact of sharing personal stories on others' lives.
Disclosing an invisible condition to employers is a personal decision: This depends on individual circumstances and the level of support within the organization. The conversation looks into the complexities of disclosing invisible conditions at work, the potential repercussions, and the importance of a supportive workplace culture for people with such conditions.
Self-Advocacy and Personal Growth: Martin and Tim discuss the importance of self-advocacy, not just in healthcare settings but also in personal relationships and workplaces, to ensure accommodations and understanding for one's needs.
Impact on Family Dynamics: ADHD affects family life, from routine tasks to communication with partners and children, underscoring the need for mutual understanding and adaptation.
The Dual Nature of Diagnosis: Receiving a diagnosis for an invisible condition can be both a relief, explaining lifelong challenges, and a source of new worries about stigma and self-identity.
Definition, Resources and Example Accommodations:
What Is Inattentive ADHD?
Individuals diagnosed often struggle with focusing on details, are prone to distractions, frequently face challenges in organizing or completing tasks, and commonly forget everyday chores.
Resources: Clevland Clinic, Ask Jan, Disclo.com
Example Accommodations: flexible work schedule, use of noise cancelling headphones, frequent breaks
Chapters:
0:00: Living With Inattentive ADHD
11:55 Navigating ADHD Diagnosis and Stigma
23:43 Navigating Transparency in Employment and Advocacy
35:16 Self-Advocacy and Relationship Dynamics
47:42 Journey of Diagnosis and Fatherhood
Transcript
Martin Hauck: 00:00
The two weeks leading up to it was just mentally exhausting. There was so much. There's so many times I could have done stuff. So at that point I was like what's wrong? Why am I so broken? Why does this always happen? This can't be normal for other people.
Tim Reitsma: 00:22
You know something isn't quite right, but you just don't know what it is and you ask yourself over and over, what's wrong with me? Now fast forward to getting a diagnosis and guess what? The questions still come. Does this new diagnosis define me? How do I tell others? How do I go about my life?
00:42
Tim here, and thank you for tuning into another episode of the Invisible Condition podcast, where we talk about advocacy and unusually normal things the conditions, diseases and illnesses we live with. We will end the stigma of invisible conditions by empowering voices, and today's voice is brought to us by Martin. It wasn't until he saw a social post from one of his friends that he decided to step out of fear, seek a diagnosis and now tell his story with the hope of breaking down stigmas. You will learn the importance of embracing your story. Be encouraged to share your story. Hear how Martin gave his partner the wrong flight details and how she flew to a completely different city, to a completely different airport, to meet him and guess what? He wasn't there. But, most importantly, how his diagnosis gave him the answers he needed. He recognized the need for change in his life and he sought and pushed for answers.
01:39
Have a listen, okay, martin, you know we connected a number of years ago of your large community caught my attention the People People Group. For anyone who's listening is in the HR space, you got to check out the People People Group. It is massive, it's growing, it's active. It is, I would say, probably North America's largest HR and People Ops group on Slack and I just I'm just so excited to have you on the podcast. I hope I did you justice with that intro, is that okay?
Martin Hauck: 02:14
No, thank you so much, very kind. I would love to take the largest title. There's definitely a few larger ones out there. The sneaky marketing thing that I like to say is that we're the most engaged, and I feel confident and honest about saying that when I look at the community in comparison, so yeah, yeah, and just to even compare that with the community of those who live with an invisible condition, because that's what we're going to be talking about, just your journey here in a sec.
Tim Reitsma: 02:52
There's more and more people, just even before we hit record. There's so many people now, at least on this podcast, saying hey, it's time to share my story. I want to share my story I haven't created a community. I've thought about it. It's something in the back of my mind. Today, we're going to talk about you. This is about your journey living with an invisible condition. Finally somebody wants to listen to me, we're here to listen.
03:19
I could probably sit here for an hour just listen to myself talk at least that's what my wife says but I don't think I'd get too many downloads on that episode. So why don't you tell us a little bit about who you are, briefly, about your story, your diagnosis, what you live with? I'm just going to leave it for you for a couple minutes.
Martin Hauck: 03:37
Sure no thanks for having me on and suggesting that I kind of take that step. I'm really grateful that you and I crossed paths in the way that we did and yeah, I would say, maybe before we met or just recently I was in the midst of like going through the diagnosis process and what I have is inattentive ADHD. And I'm 38 years old and I got diagnosed about two years ago when I was 36. And that came out of a breaking point for me, which was I've got this project do for work at my previous employer. It was a presentation and it took like every ounce of mental willpower for me to do something that probably takes people like 30 minutes tops right, like really talented people who build slides and decks all day long. And this is like a digital asset, basically, of just like I'm going to get my knowledge and put it on the paper. And it took like 15 and I had two, three weeks to do it and I left it to the last minute again and it was like two or three in the morning I was in front of my laptop just like crawling to the finish line of this deadline, exhausted, because I'm like a new dad at this point I've got a little one on the. You know a baby is coming and a two year old at the time and wildly supportive, encouraging wife and I'm just like trying to keep my crying down at two in the morning and from the laptop because I just literally can't get this presentation out of me. I don't know why. I've been there so many times before and there's this weird difference of like on the flip side of that.
06:04
The next day when I have to do the presentation, things go well and you know the time and the effort there, but the two weeks leading up to it was just mentally exhausting. There was so much there's so many times I could have done stuff. So at that point I was like what's wrong? Why am I so broken? Why does this always happen? This can't be normal for other people, and started looking into things that I had kind of assumed for a really long time and things that had, I don't know, necessarily worried me. But it didn't feel right to say that like oh, that's that's me too right. Like because the inattentive piece of ADHD is that you don't exhibit the like stereotypical behaviors of like he's really hyper and bounces off the walls and it's just like really high emotions all the time. If anything, I'm the opposite. I'm like completely monotone poker faced all the time and and whatnot. So I didn't necessarily associate myself with all of that and I guess the one thing to kind of like tie this up in a bow to a certain extent and let you kind of jump in and double click where you'd like.
07:32
But the reason I loved what you're doing with this podcast was that one of the things that gave me the strength and, I guess, the courage to even end and just like the knowledge of what to do was a friend of mine on on Facebook. His name is bang and he was posting about his journey of taking medication for ADHD and he was being just wildly vulnerable, just sharing out into the Facebook void of like hey, I'm afraid of taking this. I think my personality is going to get muted. I think you know the, the bang, who I love and know, and he was saying he was talking about himself, is just going to kind of disappear and I'm just going to turn into this drone right, and that that was the scary part for him and I shared that fear Like there's a lot of the there's a lot of things that I love about myself.
08:35
And then there's a lot of things that you know bring a ton, of ton of challenge into my life and I just couldn't, couldn't go on without trying something different, I suppose. So I'll kind of tie it off there and you can double click wherever you like.
Tim Reitsma: 08:55
Well, I appreciate you sharing your story. It does take a lot of vulnerability and that is just a big theme and a key theme that has resonated with so many, where people are listening to the vulnerable stories and are feeling a nudge inside of them as well to say, hey, maybe it's time to share my story, and we all have different reasons to share and I'm curious what? I've got a couple questions, but I'm curious why? Now, what? What makes you lean into sharing your story and not? You know, you've got your diagnosis, take your meds and continue on with your day.
Martin Hauck: 09:36
If, if, if bang didn't share his story I don't know that I would have looked into I wouldn't call taking meds a dance floor. But if I hadn't have seen that it was a way of him sort of welcoming others on to the dance floor, of just like, no, it's okay to like go here, it's okay to feel afraid. You're not the only one who is afraid going through this. And everything he was saying resonated with me specifically and I think oftentimes it's like that's such a translatable human emotion. Anything that you're afraid of, you often think you're isolated in it, and for a lot of reasons. At first it's true, but then you share it and then you realize other people are going through similar things and that's really empowering, I think, and I didn't want to it feels wronged and not pay it forward so that if someone else sees this and they reach out or it gives them like hey, you know what, I'm going to go check it out, like that's all that I think matters.
Tim Reitsma: 11:02
I had a previous : talk about permission and one of the reasons why he shares his story is that similar to what you're saying is that it almost unlocks permission for people. Yeah, we're diagnosed with something, we're going through a health crisis and we're going through something, and it feels so lonely. Even when we're surrounded by friends and family and a partner and kids, it still feels so lonely and throwing it out there into, as you said, the void of Facebook or void of social media. Yeah, it's the amount of support that just comes in and the amount of questions and people who care, complete strangers. It's empowering and I mean, one of the purposes here, at a visible condition, is to ignite social change, and it does. It starts that, it catalyzes that.
11:55
But I just want to backtrack a little bit. You're saying, hey, you're working on this presentation, you've noticed a pattern, you're down to the wire getting it done. You've noticed and you notice this pattern. I'm curious, what made you say, okay, this isn't right or I feel that this could be done differently? When have you, did you notice that pattern previously in life or throughout putting together presentations, and what was the catalyst now? Was it that Facebook post, or was it, or did you have? Had you seen it yet?
Martin Hauck: 12:37
Yeah, I would say I don't know. I think I saw it and it was a seed that needed watering and I think that breaking point was the sadly the water maybe the you know the tears, kind of like, watered that seed. But had I not seen that I don't know that I would have connected his experience and his fears to and I just would have been. I just would have kept on going and like suffering mentally from like project to project and it would have negatively impacted my work. So the fear of like I've got a family now, it's not just me and my partner, it's me, my partner and our daughters and there's a lot more on the line. So, even though I was trying harder than I'd ever tried in my life before, it was just like running into a brick wall mentally over and over again, just like this can't. Something has to change. I have to address this thing that I used to address in other unhealthy ways, mm, hmm.
Tim Reitsma: 13:51
Yeah, it's those things that they just don't go away, right, you try different coping mechanisms, whatever worked for you or you tried that, you know, masked it, but it's still there and yeah, so you pursued that diagnosis. When you received that diagnosis, how did you feel?
Martin Hauck: 14:17
It was really I don't. I won't. I don't want to say comforting, I don't even want to say like a sense of relief, because with that relief, let's say there was immediately. Now I have a stigma. Sorry, I didn't ask if we could swear, swear, but that's that's what went through my mind. It was. It was like it was like immediate relief and then immediate.
14:46
I don't know what it was, but it it wasn't just pure relief, because now I'm officially someone that has ADHD and what does this mean? Does it define me? It explains a lot. I have answers for a lot. Is it going to be my excuse now? Is it the thing that I tell other people Overtly? Are they going to judge me? Do I tell future employers about it? It's all those kind of questions and concerns washed over me in terms of. But it also was like okay, now I have a framework in which to approach a lot of the challenges in my life and if I approach it from the framework of that, maybe I'll have better, better luck with some of the things that I'm trying to accomplish.
Tim Reitsma: 15:45
I'm curious about some of the words that you use. I'm just looking at my notes. Is this an excuse? And I'm curious about that emotion or that thought that had come up. Yeah, tell me a little bit more about that, if you can.
Martin Hauck: 16:07
So what was the answer to that one? The weird thing with ADHD is that the behaviors end up looking a lot like laziness or rudeness, right. Like if I'm in a conversation and my mind is somewhere else, I might be nodding and inattentive, literally inattentive. There's inattentive and hyperactive, right. So like space cadet, or just in my own mind, and you might be telling me something and that thing might be like okay, on Sunday you need to pick up the girls at 4pm and I wasn't there for that conversation, right. And if you think about how often that happens whether in a relationship, or you have a relationship with your employer or your boss or whatever it's like if you're not present for critical information, it's not a good thing, right. And so the word excuse came from, like, well, now I have this excuse, now I have this reason, but do I lean on it? Can I lean on it? Is it something I even want to lean on? That's kind of where that word came from for me.
Tim Reitsma: 17:37
Yeah, I can imagine your partner if you did not pick up the kids, or they're you know. I just have this image of your daughter standing on the sidewalk just looking both ways so where's dad? And using it as an excuse. I don't know if that would fly, and I can relate to that. Living with Crohn sometimes I try to use that as an excuse and as an out, but my wife holds me deeply accountable too. It's like no, you need to make sure you're paying attention, make sure this isn't just a reason to not want to hang out with the kids or not want to do something. It's like I don't want to go to that party because I've got Crohn's, and sometimes my wife's like well, you're always going to have Crohn's, so maybe it's time we go. And yeah, I think it's straight, it's what's the word I'm looking for. I don't want to generalize it, at least for me, and it sounds like potentially for you, it can be an excuse, and I think it's. We need to be aware of that.
Martin Hauck: 18:43
Yeah, yeah, and on the ADHD side it absolutely can be. It's easy to be, oh right. Similarly, and gratefully, my wife has a ton of patience with me and getting diagnosed allowed me and her to like have a shared language around what's going on at times like hyperfixation, which, like you'll go downstairs without announcing it and you just won't come back upstairs, even though you said you were going to, you were going to go switch over the laundry. I'm going to go switch over the laundry and on the way there there's 15 things that catch my attention and one of those things could be something that I just hyperfix it on and I end up fixing some of the plumbing in the bathroom because I noticed something was and I just completely lose track of time and if I don't like announce it, there's sort of this like hey, I was expecting you to mind the kids with me for a little bit so I could get something of my own done. And to her it might feel like I'm disrespecting her time or just arbitrarily leaving her up there, and that's never the intention, but that's what it feels like and that's the reality of it, right, and in those moments I could pass it off as like well, you know I've got this ADHD thing so you're just going to have to deal with it.
20:20
That's not the case. No, like, I have to come up with different ways. And like you know the amount of alarms on my phone that co-off to like remind me that it's like three o'clock. So in 20 minutes you're going to go need to pick up your daughter from school. I've got three or four. And even though I have those three or four, sometimes like I'm like I'm just going to just going to finish this email or I'm just going to finish reading this thing, and sometimes I'm running from the house to go pick up my daughter and thankfully I haven't been crazy late or I've never seen that like. But that there's an extra level of accountability that comes with, you know a little one right, and that's made. That it's been. It's been something that's really forced me to kind of like address a lot of the challenges because I couldn't function in the way that I was previously. For sure.
Tim Reitsma: 21:26
Yeah, yeah, I, I hear you on that. You also said something that has caught my attention and I know others have talked about it. Actually, others have said I don't want to share my story because I'm afraid of this, and that is employers. Do I tell other employers, well, we're out of podcast. Maybe they'll listen to it on social media, on LinkedIn, because I'm going to post it out because I'm honored that you are sharing your story. I think there's so much power in sharing your story, but there's so much fear. I know there's, yeah, there's shame and fear that that often hold us back. So what do you say to someone you know, let's, let's. From the perspective of somebody who's you know, do I tell a future employer and then I want to switch the perspective of, hey, if you are a future employer, because I want to hear your perspective on that. So, yeah, I'm curious, do you tell a future employer or somebody's afraid to share their story? Or to tell their story? What do you, what do you say to that?
Martin Hauck: 22:25
Well, I want to address, like my privilege in that there's a bunch, right, you know my, my skin tone, my gender that already gives me a bunch of privilege and you know, having a invisible condition is is a challenge, but there's there's a lot of things that have come easier to me because of that and I can't necessarily ignore it. So my answer to this kind of has to be seen with that lens, in the sense that I'm very lucky to have started the community that I have, you know, seven, seven years ago, and so for me to think okay, if I'm open and honest about this, what does that do? Right now I'm relying on myself to generate income. I'm building a business and now do I know where my next paycheck is going to come from to a degree, but is it consistent? No, I'm a consultant, so things kind of work in in quarterly basis.
23:43
When I was employed, I didn't. When I got my diagnosis, I told a few people on my team, like people that were reporting into me. Let them know that I was like figuring it out. But it wasn't. It wasn't something I did lightly like, oh cool, I'm just going to do this, Like it was pretty terrifying, scary. But I kind of thought back to. I don't want to hide this because if I do, it sort of feels disingenuous, no-transcript. On the flip side, not everybody has built a community that they can just reach out to and say, hey, I lost my job for whatever reason. I'm looking for work and because of the work that I've done in the community, it would be easier for me to find something than had I not built it. That's a very unique circumstance, I think, and so the question of should you be transparent with an employer. I struggle with that because I think there's a time and a place where you will feel comfortable enough to do so and you will know those moments and in some of those moments you might find out the hard way that that wasn't. You shouldn't have trusted that individual with that information because they didn't actually realize it.
25:36
And I think I don't think the way the relationship between an employer and employee is built in a way that truly supports people with, like, there's a certain sense of normal that companies want, and it is inconvenient to an organization for an individual to just not be performing at 100% all the time, or inconvenient. And I haven't seen I've seen a lot of hope from, like, a modern HR practice perspective where a lot of people in HR are really advocating for people when they come to them and say, hey, listen, I've got this thing and I need support from my employer. But then you look on the other side of things and you see people posting online and they might not even have an invisible condition, they might not even have a visit, they might not be, and the employer-employee relationship still hasn't gotten to this place of like. Yeah, we figured this out and most companies do it pretty well. Unfortunately, it's not the case.
27:02
The great places to work are few and far between, I think, in terms of like really being welcoming to that sort of thing, and that's a little bit of a pessimistic view. But I think, unless you are especially in like the market today in terms of like, I'm looking at this from the lens of like the startup and tech community. But if, unless you're super confident that you can just find another opportunity at a moment's notice or you have something to lean on like, I would only really share it if you are in a place where you can afford to, because I haven't seen a ton of acceptance and maybe you have someone individually at the organizations. Who's understanding, but companies are large and complex and your manager might change and someone might share the information if you become more open about it.
28:13
I was open about it with my team. I don't know if that was the cause of like. I don't know if that played a part in me getting laid off I don't think it was but I'm sure somewhere in the back of someone's mind they could have looked back on some of the things that I'd maybe didn't get done quick enough or didn't turn around quick enough and said, okay, well, maybe we don't need to. So that's a long answer and it's a tricky one. I think the short version is you'll know when it's right for yourself, I think.
Tim Reitsma: 28:58
Yeah, I appreciate you call a pessimistic view, I call it a realistic view. It's a realist view where you know it's a pretty general question. I realized saying asking hey, you know, should you share? It depends on the circumstance, it depends on your organization.
29:15
There's so many factors that go into it. Some have the opportunity to have time on their side to share when they're comfortable. Some don't. I had to share with an organization because I was in the hospital and I was like phone up my boss, I was like, hey, I'm not going to be in because you know my bowels exploded and I'm going to be in the hospital for a little bit. You know they reacted very positively, but I've also heard many stories of companies and organizations not reacting positively and it's scary. There's also, you know it's so. It's an individual's choice and I would say, if it is affecting your performance, if it's affecting your ability to do the job, maybe there's, maybe it's time to say have a conversation with someone, whether it's HR, whether it's your leader, and just be open and honest about it, about what's going on, because the last thing we want is for someone to not step in and to that vulnerability and end up losing a job.
30:21
And so, you know, there's power in that voice and it's kind of leads to the next question, which is something that's been on my mind for for about a month now, is this term self-advocacy. Because you know, you're a father, I'm a father. I think of a world where, you know, my kids are my kids are a little bit older than yours but a world where, if they live with something that's invisible, how, how do we want to encourage them to advocate for themselves and step into, let's say, that they're diagnosed with something? And you know, I'm curious when, when you hear that, especially, you know, when I talk about my kids in that way, I just, you know, makes lots of emotions come up, and there's what's coming up for you in that world of self-advocacy and thinking of the future.
Martin Hauck: 31:15
My daughter this morning asked me like Daddy, why are we always like rushing to school? And like part of it is just, you know, she doesn't put her jacket on and she wants to do a million other things before we leave the house for school and what not. Another part of it is like I probably could have managed my time a little better. Maybe I didn't, maybe I shouldn't have made my coffee, maybe I should have just like been more of a more forceful and like okay, cool, let's get your jacket on and your boots on and let's go kind of thing right and on the way I was. You know there's no, there's probably there are books, for sure. There's books on how to be a parent. I haven't read any of them, partially because you know my attention span for that stuff isn't that great. But the other, like, I learned best through experience and discussion, which is why I enjoy these conversations and talking about it with other people. But the self-advocacy piece and the thing I thought in that moment, you know, when she asked me that question, I'm like, well, daddy's brain works a little bit differently sometimes, and it's like I also told her. I'm like, do you also just need to like put your jacket on a little bit quicker and faster sometimes and like part of that's me and part of that's you and as a two-way straight and we're a team. But I kind of gave her a sneak preview into the fact that, like, yeah, I've, you know, my brain works a little bit differently. Sometimes people remember everything and sometimes daddy doesn't, and sometimes daddy doesn't remember important things and that's hard and I think it was more of like a foreshadowing to her that like, hey, this is a thing there's.
33:30
There's a lot of guilt and shame that comes with ADHD, because the end result is disappointing to others when things go poorly and so that, having happened so many times, you just build it up over time and it always comes back to to yourself.
33:47
So the self-advocacy piece, I think for For me and if I'm going off track here, feel free to nudge me in the right direction but it kind of goes back to wanting to pay it forward Always goes back to that. Had Bang not shared his experiences on Facebook, I don't feel like I would have dove in and researched and felt comfortable because he was sharing sort of like a video blog and he was saying like, hey, I didn't lose that part of me that I felt really attached to like the fun and personable and kooky crazy side he didn't turn into like the mindless drone that he was worried about in terms of like taking the medication and being like muted from a personality perspective, and that was really that gave me permission to sort of explore further, gave me reduced some of the fear in it. So if it feels disrespectful to not self maybe I'm misunderstanding here, now I'm realizing it. I've probably gone on a little bit of a tangent, but yeah, that's where my mind went when you asked that.
Tim Reitsma: 35:13
Yeah, no, I don't think it's too far off. On a tangent, I think I could just picture your daughter asking why are we always rushing? And part of self advocacy to me is being open and honest, even with the littles in our lives, in our family.
Martin Hauck: 35:32
The littles yeah.
Tim Reitsma: 35:34
With my kids. My daughter is six and she's asked me why are you always running to the washroom before we leave the house? And I need to explain to her that if I don't, we will likely need to stop somewhere along the way, whether we're going for a walk or a drive. For me to rush into a washroom because my bowels work differently and you know she's then will crack a few jokes If you ever meet my daughter. She's very sarcastic at six and likes to joke around, and so we have some fun with that. But it's being open and honest, and then it's also telling people what we need.
36:16
So, like with your daughter, it's hey, we're working as a team, this is what we need, and I tell people like, hey, if you're going to advocate for yourself at the doctors, you got to be crystal clear on what's happening and crystal clear what you need. And same with our kids, same with the little people in our lives, the friends, the family because they can't read our minds. Nobody can read our minds. Somebody says, hey, I can read your mind. They're wrong. I think I have a fun conversation, but I think it's a large part of it, especially with our kids. It's not shying away from what's going on.
36:55
And it makes us our quote unquote normal. Because, yeah, your brain works differently than your daughters, works differently than your partners, works differently than mine, and owning that, stepping into it, I think there's power in that.
Martin Hauck: 37:11
Yeah, I understand the question a bit better now and I would say, to add to what my answer was on the advocacy piece, I'll give an example. That's a funny story now. So I was invited to speak at a HR tech conference in San Francisco. Oh, I just made the mistake again. No, san Jose, and I was going to buy tickets. And my wife's like, oh, it would be fun. And this was before kids. So he's like, oh, it'd be fun if, like, we, like I, flew down at the same time and you know, I go do my thing, and then we can meet up after your speaking and engagement and make like a weekend trip out of it. I was like, okay, yeah, that's cool. She's like cool, cool, I'm going to buy tickets. I'm going to buy tickets. I'm hey, I'm buying tickets. It's coming up in a month. Now I'd like to buy some airline tickets. And for me, I'm like even there's just a concept of, like the time window. I'm like, oh, it should be cheaper. It should be cheaper when you know, because it's and that's not how flight tickets work. But she's like I'm buying a ticket and so you buy your own ticket and you know if we're on the same flight, great and that was like a little bit of a sticking point. So came like a week before, like a few days before, and I'm buying my tickets to go there. I'm like double the price, which is already like a stupid thing in the first place. And turns out she was like oh, you know when are you flying into? And I'm like, oh, I fly into this airport, you know, at this time she's like what did you say? I'm like, yeah, like she's like that's, that's San Diego. I got tickets to San Jose. Oh, mixed up the sands. San Francisco, san Diego, san Jose, mixed them up. Mixed them up. Didn't give you the right information. You're flying to a city on the same day that I am, but it's just four hours away from the city that I'm going to. Wonderful, the fact that I'm still married out of that mistake is a testament to how awesome and patient and kind my partner is.
39:55
After that experience, once we got through some of the more challenging aspects of, like you know, making a mistake like that, you know, you know you're going to be like oh, I started to dig in a little bit more. I'm like well, you do everything analog right, her diary is either in her head, her calendar, you know her appointments and who we're seeing next weekend is in her head and everything for me is digital and if it's not in the calendar it doesn't actually exist. For me, it's not real, essentially. And so the biggest fix to our relationship and some of our biggest challenges and fights and arguments was us sitting down and saying, okay, so this part of me doesn't work in the same way. And so my ask of you is that, like, you start using the digital calendar, and where I will meet you in the middle to a certain extent is, I'll try to keep the whiteboard calendar that you use more up to date.
41:03
And that was a good moment for us to realize, like, okay, we need to work together more on some of these operational logistic things as a couple. You throw kids into that and all the appointments and dates and times and, like you, can you know there's a level of like. Every once in a while now I get to say like, okay, sorry, I didn't hear anything you just said not intentional. And she, like, can you say that again? And I'm gonna put this into my phone now and if she sees me doing that, she knows that like the chances of me doing the right thing at the right time, just exponentially increase.
Tim Reitsma: 41:49
Okay, a couple of things are coming up is okay, I like applaud your partner for sticking with you. It's like I've just applied to a completely different city. Sorry about that, oops, my mistake. And but then being able to reconcile that and sitting down and saying, okay, even self-advocacy doesn't have to be necessarily outside of our homes, with doctors and workplaces and things like that, it's also with the people that are close to us, is, hey, this is what I need. And hearing the reciprocating, this is what I need from our partners, from our friends, and meeting in the middle, like having that open dialogue, is so, so key to relationship and it unlocks at just a deeper level of friendship and with our friends, with our partners, with our family. Would you agree?
Martin Hauck: 42:42
Yeah, now me and Karina end up going to the same place most of the time.
Tim Reitsma: 42:47
Most of the time. I'm so curious to hear her perspective of the story. Maybe I'll have to ask her or get her contacted.
Martin Hauck: 42:54
She tells it regularly. She actually tells it regularly, yeah.
Tim Reitsma: 42:59
Yeah, which is that over going to? Yeah, san Jose, san Francisco, san Diego, yeah.
Martin Hauck: 43:04
I blame California. Really, this isn't a me problem, it's a California problem, like who does that honestly?
Tim Reitsma: 43:10
It is, you know, the best of us like, yeah, I could imagine if I was to go book tickets I'd probably mess that up too. And it is a California. We're gonna write a letter. I'll write a letter after this and I'll put it into chat GPT and see what comes out so we can start a petition and change California.
Martin Hauck: 43:31
You've got your first signer here.
Tim Reitsma: 43:33
Yeah, I love it. Well, Bart, you know I really appreciate you. I appreciate your openness, your vulnerability. Your demeanor in how you tell your story is something that is honestly. It's inspiring to me and for those who are listening, who are thinking, and maybe it's time to tell my story. How would you encourage someone to even start?
Martin Hauck: 44:04
Start telling their own story. Well, my initial thought was like only do what's comfortable. And then immediately my mind's like growth doesn't really come through comfort. So does it mean like jumping onto a podcast right off the bat? Like it really depends on wearing into classic HR answer. Right, it depends, but I would say it depends on where you're at.
44:47
I think I'm really grateful that I've gotten to a place where I do feel comfortable. This is like I'm not like, oh, this is great. Like there's a sense of nervousness. There's a sense of like oh, did I do the right thing? Am I doing like I'm starting a business? Maybe I shouldn't put this out there so openly. And then there's another part of me that says I have gotten so far already and I've been pretty transparent. If I can keep making it okay for others to share, or muster up some courage to maybe just tell a friend or a family member or a boss or like. It's not going to be easy, but I think if you start trying in small ways and you do it consistently, one day you'll end up looking back and sort of laughing at yourself that you thought it was so scary at the time. And that's kind of what happens with everything. I think so.
Tim Reitsma: 46:04
Yeah, there's discomfort in stepping out, and I love what you said. Growth doesn't come through comfort and so if you're listening to this, maybe it's opportunity to get uncomfortable, and it might be for selfish reasons, and I applaud you for that. It might be for reasons where out of necessity, and I applaud you for that. So lots of good insight in that, martin. So, as we wrap up, I'm curious if somebody wants to know more, wants to connect with you, wants to hear more about your journey and maybe dig into some of the insights you shared, where can people reach you?
Martin Hauck: 46:42
Yeah, find me at LinkedIn probably the best, easiest way as a recruiter by trade. That's Martin Hauke, h-a-u-c-k. And find me on LinkedIn yeah, that's the easiest way, martin H-A-U-C-Kca as well. Kind of shows you all the things. I just recently got rid of Instagram for obvious reasons, spending way too much time there just going down like those stories and the algorithms are just getting bananas for attention spans, adhd or not. It's just concerning. So I'm no longer on the Insta and you can find me on LinkedIn.
Tim Reitsma: 47:38
Sounds good. Well, I'll put your links in the show notes as well. And again, thank you for opening up, honestly and vulnerably, your journey of diagnosis with Intentive ADHD and your journey as a father and sharing with your kids and as well as, I hope, your next trip with your rising partner, you get up at the same place and if not, I hope you have two separate trips. Yeah, fingers crossed.
Martin Hauck: 48:09
There's the bright side to it, right. Oh, how was your vacation? Yeah, it was great. That was good. You could divide in concrete.
Tim Reitsma: 48:15
You could see a lot of the world, right, If you just keep it's not gonna work that way.
Martin Hauck: 48:19
It takes to the wrong place no, don't think so Not gonna work that way.
Tim Reitsma: 48:21
No, Well, again, thanks for coming on and for those who are listening. I love it when you shoot me an email, shoot me a message, whether it's through the website or social, and just tell me what you thought about this week's episode. Also, what really helps the podcast get noticed is if you take a moment and just give us a rating and write a review, and if it's a terrible review, if you're not enjoying it, just shoot me a message. I would appreciate that instead of posting it publicly. But hey, if you wanna do that too, don't hold back. And with that, I just hope everyone has an amazing day. And again, thanks, martin, for coming on.
Martin Hauck: 49:00
Thank you Tim.
